Not sure if this is an Astoria thing or a city-wide thing, but I've noticed over the last year that a lot of pedestrians treat the flashing red hand — the one that starts after the white walk symbol — as a starting gun rather than a signal to clear the intersection. I know it's a petty gripe, but it's gotten to the point where I'm the only person still standing at the curb near 31st St and 30th Ave when the countdown hits 8.

This morning, I watched a dad with a stroller step off the curb with 5 on the clock, right into the middle of the left-turn lane. The left-turning driver had a green arrow and had to stop mid-turn; half the crosswalk ended up blocked. The dad made it across, but only by doing that little jog-stroller bounce, and then he gave the driver a look like the car was in the wrong.

To be clear: the flashing red hand means do not begin crossing. If you're already in the crosswalk when it starts, you're supposed to continue at a normal pace, but you're not supposed to start a new crossing on the flashing hand. The countdown is showing how much time remains for people who are already in the intersection, not an invitation to sprint. At least that's what I've always understood from the DMV manual and the DOT.

I get that nobody wants to wait a whole light cycle on a wide intersection, especially when the countdown says 15 and you know you can make it. But the last five seconds are chaos — that's when cars are already committed to turns, delivery riders are already leaning into the throttle, and everyone else in the crosswalk is trying to finish. Stepping off late doesn't just put you at risk; it traps the people already crossing.

Am I the only one who still waits? What's the actual line for you — do you start at 10? 5? Do you treat it as case-by-case depending on the block? And before someone says it: yes, turning drivers are also awful at yielding. That's a whole separate gripe.

Oh man, I moved here from a place that didn't have countdown timers at all, so I thought the blinking numbers meant how long you had left to cross if you started from the curb. I've definitely started at 5 and did the power walk of shame. I thought the white walk guy was just a suggestion, to be honest. This is probably why I got honked at near Queens Plaza last week. So the flashing hand is not an invitation? I'm sorry to everyone I've annoyed. Also, why do the buttons not seem to change anything? I pressed one and waited through a full cycle.

I visited my cousin here last month and had the same misunderstanding. In my hometown the countdown is for the entire crossing — when it hits zero the light turns, but you're allowed to start while it's counting down. I started at 10 on 34th St and a delivery e-bike swung into the crosswalk and missed me by like a foot. I said 'I have the walk signal' but he just waved without looking. Are pedestrians allowed to start as long as the hand is still flashing, or is flashing already a 'stop'? I thought flashing red hand was like a yellow light for people. No one has ever honked at me before for walking.

Rural_to_queens and smalltown_steph, you're not alone. The flashing red hand is closer to the yellow — it means clear if you're already in, but don't enter. In New York, the actual rule is that a pedestrian shall not start crossing on a flashing 'Don't Walk' signal. The countdown is just a supplement. But I want to be careful: I'm not a traffic lawyer, and enforcement for pedestrians is practically zero, so the legal rule and the social rule have split.

Where I see the most dangerous version is when people start with 8 or fewer seconds on a two-way street with a dedicated left turn. At that point the turning vehicles have a green arrow, and they're scanning for a gap, not for a stroller entering late. Even if the driver is technically required to yield, the driver is already in the intersection and launched.

For rural_to_queens, the buttons: some are on a fixed cycle and do nothing during certain phases. The ones that make a difference usually need to be pressed before the cross street gets its green. If you press after the hand is already flashing, you're probably not going to get a fresh walk. It's not broken — just too late.

For smalltown_steph, the e-bike part is a separate problem. Even when you have the white walk guy, right-turning delivery riders often roll into the crosswalk because they're trying to beat the light. They're supposed to yield to pedestrians, but I'd advise treating them like you would a car: make eye contact before stepping off the curb. It shouldn't be on you, but it often is.

Thanks, astoria_arch. That makes sense. So if I'm standing at the curb and the hand starts flashing at 15, I should just wait for the next cycle? That's hard on Northern Blvd where the next walk signal can be a while. I tried waiting this morning and a woman behind me said 'it's still 6, you can make it' and went around me. Then a bus turning made that air brake noise. Do you just wait and let people go around? And is Queens Blvd timing shorter than Manhattan? I swear the countdown on Queens Blvd disappears faster than on 5th Ave. Maybe I'm just walking slower than I think.

I'm still confused about who has the right of way when a delivery scooter is already in the crosswalk. If I step off on the white walk guy and they're turning into me, am I supposed to stop? I've seen people yell and bang on the back of a delivery bike. Also, are they allowed to ride in the crosswalk at all? I thought motorized bikes were supposed to be in the street or a bike lane, not on the sidewalk. My cousin says 'they do whatever they want.' So is the crosswalk basically a shared lane now? Asking because I don't want to get run over.

smalltown_steph, the short answer is no, they're not supposed to ride in the crosswalk or on the sidewalk. The long answer is that enforcement is inconsistent, and a lot of delivery riders use the crosswalk to position for a turn or skip a double-parked car. Legally, pedestrians in a crosswalk with the walk signal have the right of way over turning vehicles, including bikes and scooters. But the practical right-of-way is often determined by whoever is already moving and bigger. I've stopped mid-crosswalk for an e-bike that came from behind the BQE ramp near Astoria and never even saw me. It's infuriating, but stepping out in front of a throttle e-bike isn't the hill I want to die on.

Rural_to_queens, yes, you technically should wait if the hand is flashing before you step off. Whether people do is another matter. On Queens Blvd, the crossing distances are longer and the signal phases are tuned for vehicle movement, not pedestrian comfort. I find that if the countdown is 15 or more and the crosswalk is narrow, most New Yorkers will start. Under 10, I stay put unless I'm already at the curb and can see no turning traffic. It's not about being polite; it's about not getting caught mid-lane when the light changes.

One tip: if you're going to wait, stand a step back from the curb but not so far that you end up as a barrier. People will flow around you. That's normal. Don't let social pressure push you into a crossing you can't finish safely.

I just tried the 'stand back and let them go around' tip this morning on Queens Blvd and it actually worked. A guy in a suit gave me a look, but he also almost got clipped by an MTA bus, so I felt fine about my choice. The thing I still don't get: some intersections have the white walk guy for exactly four seconds, then flashing for twenty. Others have white walk for a long time. Is that because of the beg button or just the traffic light pattern? I pressed the button before the light changed and did get a walk signal, so maybe it does work. Do you always press it even if a bunch of people are already waiting? I feel weird pushing it when someone is standing right there.

Okay, I need to know: has anyone ever actually seen a ticket given for crossing on the flashing hand? I've been in NYC for two weeks now and I've crossed at 5 multiple times because everyone else was doing it. One time a cop car was right there and they did not care. I think the rule is just not enforced, which makes it hard to take seriously. But I also don't want to be the one person waiting at an empty intersection while a delivery scooter gives me a nod like 'you know you can go, right?' My cousin says 'just go if the cross street hasn't moved yet.' Is that the local rule? Because that's not what the signal says.

Rural_to_queens, the white walk guy duration isn't random. It's usually set according to the crossing distance and the signal's timing plan. At some Queens Blvd intersections, the pedestrian phase is only a few seconds of solid white before the flashing hand, even though the full crossing might need 20+ seconds. That's not you being slow. Some of those crossings were clearly timed for cars first, pedestrians second. I always press the button if I'm first to arrive, even if other people are there; sometimes it shortens the wait or guarantees the walk phase. If someone's already pushed it, pressing again won't hurt.

Smalltown_steph, I have never once seen a pedestrian get a ticket for starting on the flashing hand. I've seen plenty of near misses. The lack of enforcement is real, and it's why most people treat the countdown as a suggestion. The informal city rule is more or less: 'if the cross street hasn't moved yet and you can clear it before the light changes, go.' But that's exactly the logic that puts a stroller in the left-turn lane at the worst moment. I think a better rule is: 'can I clear it without breaking stride? If yes, maybe. If I'd have to jog, wait.'

I tried the 'press the button even if someone's there' thing at 46th St and Queens Blvd. A woman said 'it already pressed, you don't have to break it.' I felt dumb but the walk sign came on sooner than I expected. Maybe she was right. Also, when the hand flashes with 20 seconds left on a four-lane crossing, is that enough time for a normal person? I'm 5'3 and not fast. I ended up having to do the little half-jog at the end. Do city planners think we all have sprinter legs?

I'm starting to think the countdown numbers are just for show on some blocks. Yesterday at 6th Ave and 42nd, the flashing hand said 12, but the cross street light turned green at 8. I was halfway and a cab floored it. My cousin said the driver was wrong, but he didn't care. Can cars turn while the hand is flashing if no one's crossing? Or do they have to wait for the crosswalk to clear completely? Because they definitely don't. Also, why do some countdowns freeze and then jump? I saw one stuck at 10 for like five seconds. Is that normal?

Rural_to_queens, 20 seconds on a four-lane crossing can be tight, especially if you're short or not a speed walker. The city's assumptions about walking speed aren't generous for everyone. I've done the same half-jog at Northern Blvd. It's not you.

Smalltown_steph, a car can technically complete a turn while the hand is flashing, but only after yielding to people already in the crosswalk. What drivers often do instead is treat the flashing hand as 'no new pedestrians' and the crosswalk as empty, even when someone is still in lane two. That's why the countdown matters. The freeze/jump thing is usually a signal timing adjustment or a pedestrian phase hold; it's annoying but not broken.

If I had to sum up this whole thread: the flashing red hand is not a starting pistol. It's the warning that the starting pistol already fired and you should already be on your way out, not still at the curb. Wait if you can, cross if you're already committed, and never trust a turning e-bike just because the signal says you're right. You might be right, but they're already moving.